It is something that has fascinated me, and this Metcalfe interview did not disappoint!!! But it has not always been that way or worked in his favor. Thank you as well for your research, especially your work on New Approaches to the Book of Mormon. Im sure there is a very good possibility that COB personnel would have been more suspect of Jerald, and any information he offered, than Hofmann. They are in a tough spot. Its the same adhominem from his whole establishment that shows how much they think they own the intellectual world. dave davies wife. I have never heard of the description that its like talking to someone in the airport on their cell phone, with all the background noise. [4] Metcalfe had become an ardent supporter of the counterfeited Salamander letter, and hired by Christensen to research the letter. Or if you have any thoughts on this John? I could read fine in private but the social damage was done and anxiety overwhelmed me every time. It is better thought of by non-Catholics (generally), but this has not translated into conversions or retention of cradle Catholics. Also, make sure your second recording matches the first. What was most poignant to me was Brents description of his failure of faith. I am so grateful I stumbled across them along with D. Michael Quinns books wow now 20 years ago. Mark Metcalfe Project Manager - Heavy Lift Division at Western Mechanical Electrical Millwright Services Ltd. Kitchener, Ontario, Canada 500+ connections Why do you think the church is so fearful, silencing members and burying facts ? The insight into the many corners of Mormonism important to us here was delicious. Brent Metcalf - Wrestling Coach - Iowa State University Athletics It seems like in the aftermath of the bombings, combined with his zeal to argue the history of Mormonism, Brent Metcalfe was excommunicated from The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. Riveting stuff. So sorry Maxine! Without good research, ours is a heritage shallow in meaning. pigella miraculous ladybug power. Im sure this applies to other beliefs as well. Powered by WordPress.com VIP. I just discovered this on my own I bought every single issue of the 7th East Press, and was so disappointed that I missed picking up the final April Fools issue which appeared around campus after the edict banning it from being sold on campus. As I went towards the house, this thought came into my mind, why do I feel so different from what I did a short time past : I am unspeakably happy and shall never see trouble again.. Brent most recently served with the Information Security/Communication Security with the Wyoming Army National Guard as an IT Specialist. Its done. brent metcalfe excommunicated - knowthemquicker.com Youre one of the few secular critics of the church that can offer a really long perspective on challenges to Mormonisms truth claims. It would have helped me a lot to know I was not alone. Lynn Jacobs was looked at carefully, I believe Brent Metcalf was looked at somewhat. You know, guilt by association. The irony is, I wasnt an activist for anything, I simply wanted to write. What about your book did the church find cause to excommunicate you? Hamblin Methodological discussions have become commonplace in Mormon studies. I have to assume hes simply speaking on the basis of snippets of information here and there without context, because this is clearly untrue. I was there at the very beginning. It seems to me that going with what you may think everyone around knows is right (even if it isnt) more easily allows for these kinds of experiences more than realizing there are differences of opinion and thought and then vying for spiritual confirmation. going back ten+ years when we first interacted online (message boards), but this interview gave me many more insights. I also appreciate your parting words. I have some insights into that. Its probably best to start over when these things happen, rather than just continuing where you left off. I have one teensy-tiny criticism about Johns sensitivity when someone questioned why Brent did not pursue an advanced degree. Anyone know what that is and where I can find out more? Life changing! [9] Metcalfe became a suspect himself at one point in time. This theory is now well accepted in academia. Yes, please delineate with a rough timeline, recent vs. re-exposed critiques of the books. As a Mormon History and Rare Document Researcher, Brent Metcalfe has unparalleled knowledge of the religion and its connections in Utah. In Part 2, Brent describes working for and with Steve Christensen and Mark Hofmann, the Salamander Letter episode, and the bombings that took the lives of Steve and Kathy Sheets. Near the end of a presentation you gave for the ExMormon Foundation, you said something to the effect of: People ask me how Joseph Smith wrote the Book of Mormon, how he pulled it off, how it all came about. What would you say are the most significant developments in the critiques of the church in the past 20 years that didnt exist beforehand? On the latest episode of Mormon Book Reviews Steven Pynakker interviews one of the most important scholars of Mormonism, Brent Metcalfe. Helping us understand all the ins and outs of this tale throughout the three episodes of this series is Brent Metcalfe, so lets find out more about him, shall we? The triplet Egyptian Alphabet manuscripts and the bound Grammar and Alphabet of the Egyptian Language also elaborate the Katumin narrative. It seems there is some serious self deception that is required to work around these problems that are creating riffs in families, as well as individual conflicts of spiritual dissonance for good members and leaders of the church. Watch the full match. We Elders thought this was powerful truth, to compliment the claims of the Book of Mormon, to convince the Jew and Gentile. What are your views about these books and how some contemporary Mormon scholars approach them as catalytic for revelation, though they may not specifically be historical? Dissident LDS intellectuals say excommunications will continue End of my short story. brent metcalfe excommunicated - dialectic.solutions The confessionals in the documentary of Hofmann's associates, such as Shannon Flynn, Brent Metcalf and George Throckmorton are captivating. Fantastic interviews. I think that the LDS churchs main competitor in the marketplace of ideas is not a bigger tent more liberal church, its Agnosticism/atheism. She spoke of her life and what has happened in the 30 years since one of Utah's most infamous crimes, Thursday October 8, 2015. Can you offer any insight to this? "Everybody that ever dealt with Mark Hofmann was a victim of his, and of his deception, and I think it's just kind of a . For the listeners who are curious, a portion of the book describes a first vision, copied below: https://play.google.com/books/reader?printsec=frontcover&output=reader&id=XH0rAAAAYAAJ&pg=GBS.PA54, The Lamb once slain appeared to my understanding, and while viewing him, I felt such love to him as I never felt to anything earthly. Little trace of Morison survives for much of the early 1540s, but it is clear that he built up his landed base and attached himself to . Should have added one more minor thing. Pardon me for not commenting on LDS church history, but to be honest Ive read it or heard it all and have moved on. Murder Among The Mormons, Brent Metcalfe Story - YouTube In Part 1, Brent talks about his early days in the Church and his time working for Church security. Where we should push back is, if someone solely discredits someone without examples of where their information is wrong or flawed ie simply attacking the messenger instead of the message. For more information, please see our [9], As it began to be clearer that Hofmann was counterfeiting documents, Christensen and Kathy Sheets were murdered in an separate bombs created by Hofmann, and Hofmann himself was injured when a later bomb he created inadvertently exploded. Iowa's Brent Metcalf wrestles with Iowa State's Mitch Mueller during their 149 pound match Friday, March 19, 2010 in the quarterfinal round of the 2010 NCAA Division 1 Wrestling Championships at . Growing up in the Eleventh Ward, you seemed very different than the Terry, Larry and Scott group. My question to Brent is during or after authoring/editing New Approaches to the Book Mormon, did he have other or similar spiritual experiences that confirmed the historical facts (which may be viewed as counter experiences to those earlier in the church)? Talk about ADD. That piqued my interest in the whole sordid affair. Its very sunny in London today and Ive listened too all eleven hours of this interview. Ive always wondered if my church record was blighted in some way. John Dehlin Faces Excommunication. Unintended consequences here we come! It also struck me that Brent in some ways represents the inverse of Sandra Tanner. Do you think he will ever come completely clean? On the term translation, JS promoted his ancient texts as translations in the traditional sense. Why didnt the Lord reveal to the the prophet that Hofmann was going to kill? They have shown time and time again that that is all that matters to them. Thanks Brent for sharing your story with usand to John for bringing it to us. And it leaves this distrust in LDS leaders hanging with the viewer. Also, the rest of your experience is so totally mind-blowing-interesting. Thank you so much for being so open and honest that particular issue. Cultural Context Preceding the Book of Mormon, https://traffic.libsyn.com/secure/mormonstories/493__Brent_Metcalfe_Part_1.mp3, https://traffic.libsyn.com/secure/mormonstories/494__Brent_Metcalfe_Part_2.mp3, https://traffic.libsyn.com/secure/mormonstories/MormonStories-497-BrentMetcalfePt3.mp3, https://traffic.libsyn.com/secure/mormonstories/MormonStories-498-BrentMetcalfePt4.mp3, https://traffic.libsyn.com/secure/mormonstories/MormonStories-499-BrentMetcalfePt5.mp3, https://traffic.libsyn.com/secure/mormonstories/MormonStories-499b-BrentMetcalfePt6.mp3, https://www.utlm.org/onlinebooks/trackingconfessions1.htm, Signature Books Mormon News, October 1317. He also discusses the events leading up to, and including, his excommunication. Metcalf served as the National Freestyle Developmental Coach prior to . Brent Metcalf was a bad dude in high school. Its great to find all this background information. At one point John asks you if you think JS was putting together a scam or if you believe that he believed it himself. During my 7779 mission I served in two London areas, living first in Kilburn Park and later in Wimbledon. I am still cringing from the realizations about the lack of discernment and the deliberate efforts on the part of the GAs. And a small footnote: Many of these original founders had been part of an on-campus group, called the Open Door Club. I suppose the precedent was set by Joseph himself in burning down the Nauvoo Expositor because he didnt like the content, and labelled it anti Mormonit wasnt even, William Law was a believer, who could no longer take Josephs hypocrisy. So yes, Brent, please comment on this phenomenon. Ron Priddis was my friend, and had recruited me to be a writer. Brent Metcalf's Career Timeline - FloWrestling Joyce Skabelund October 9, 1938 January 10, 2023 Our mother, grandma, and friend, Joyce Roth Skabelund, 84, departed this life on 10 January 2023. Brent Metcalf (47 matches): Phone Number, Email, Address - Spokeo As coincidence would have it, a few months later I became her home teacher. As someone told him, You didnt have a crisis of faith but a Failure of Faith. He also talks about his early forays into Mormon studies. But I feel that sometimes secular scholars, perhaps in an effort to be diplomatic, perhaps for other reasons, underestimate and understate the inevitability of open conflict with a religious tradition they study. Also, I appreciate you bringing up ADD. Awesome. I sensed a full range of colors in the photo that is this interview. Renaissance And Reform In Tudor England: The Careers Of Sir Richard Yes, because remember that the paradigm speaking through Mikes words is not just representative of him. Hi Brent, Thank you for your insights and open heart. 30 years after Mormon bombings, Mark Hofmann's ex-wife finds peace and I believe Brent said he has the copy in his records.**. So, so good. After years of palling around with anti-Mormon apostates (e.g. Rude Dog Never fear! !Cmoninstead, they were duped arranged for major amounts of $ to buy the letter up,bury it and then lie. I clearly remember the frustration in her voice. Thanks! document.getElementById( "ak_js_1" ).setAttribute( "value", ( new Date() ).getTime() ); This site uses Akismet to reduce spam. :). In Part 5, we explore the history surrounding Joseph Smith and the Book of Abraham(one of the primary scriptural texts for the LDS Church). 2005, page 147, 180, Sillitoe, L., & Roberts, A. D. (1988). I just looked down at the paper and I felt this wave of total anxiety come over me and then all of a sudden it was like my brain stopped working and it felt like I was looking at a different language. In 1539 he was elected as an MP for the rst time and was appointed to serve in the King's Privy Chamber. We may be on our own and need to create our own justice and future, but its possible that Providence does in fact sometimes intervene. All he had to say publicly if there was really no truth in it, was its simply not true and leave it at that. To those people like me, however, who find themselves on the butt end of his speeches, may consider him to come across as aggressive, brash and unsympathetic. However, they still mention other things in their presentations (if you can stand to listen to them; I dont particularly like Jake Hiltons rhetoric, but Wayne May is pretty interesting to listen to)that are pretty fascinating and almost convincing. 1) In your opinion, which group is currently winning in their arguments regarding the truth claims of church, the critics or the apologetics? Why are they so adamant about excommunicating someone who has a different opinion than they do? What do you think about the DCP/Hamblin FARMS implosion? What if we are all chasing literal meanings of words such as translation, ages and names while in effect they are meant to have symbolic meaning and by this to explain esoteric principles to insiders. By accepting all cookies, you agree to our use of cookies to deliver and maintain our services and site, improve the quality of Reddit, personalize Reddit content and advertising, and measure the effectiveness of advertising. It is true that Mac Christiansen did pay for Marks sons mission. Afraid that Brent would go public with the contradictory information, the LDS church terminated him as a member. Let me clarify. I know about the September 6 and there are others. It is important that we be critical thinkers and examine the sources providing information, in the same way we would want to know the credentials of someone dispensing medical advice, car repair advice etc. Elbert was the managing editor, and Ron the financial guy, so I had the impression that Elbert created the whole thing. This is the part Im most interested in: how would he suggest young aspiring researchers go about gathering and parsing primary and secondary sources?. Indeed, the trivial matters that many theists assert as claiming the attention of God (even as hell is meanwhilebreaking loose) is absurd evidently too absurd for many to even grasp. In fact, it may just be possible that I stood right next to Brent during our official kick off meeting, when Elbert invited his brother Lyle to give us all a magic show. (I think that was my only disappointment, that Brent basically gave up on God because of an epiphany.). But are there any podcasts that go deeper in to Gnostics, esoteric teachings, metaphysics, etc. I may have a chance to look for it next week, but Im not promising anything. None of this means that believing scholars and secular scholars have to treat each other poorly or that we cannot respect (even in the midst of serious disagreement) each others work. document.getElementById( "ak_js_1" ).setAttribute( "value", ( new Date() ).getTime() ); This site uses Akismet to reduce spam. I was nervous that you belonged to the catalyst crowd and relieved to hear your developed belief, or non belief. Funny how I was taught at BYU The Glory of God is Intelligence I find comfort in knowing I am not alone. This is what led me here! In these two episodes we discuss: 1) The aftermath of the Mark Hofmann bombings, and Brent's. Examples would be projects at the Serpent Mounds in Ohio, linguists studying things like Native Americans singing in a language that seemed close to Hebrew,archaeological digs in latin America that were obviously BOM related, etc. What are your views on how the Book of Mormon was created? Azerbaijan's Jabrayil Hasanov in action against The USA's Brent Metcalf. SALT LAKE CITY Egyptologist Ed Ashment sympathizes with Washington anthropologist for now has escaped excommunication from the LDS Church. Awesome music, right? Thats something each person must decide for themselves, but Ive made peace with my own interpretation.. "The Mormon murders: A true story of greed, forgery, deceit, and death." I love the podcasts. Did John take the tapes home to show his wife? And theres no way that you can change it. I think that it speaks volumes about their powers of discernment and what they truly think about Joseph Smith. I am very excited to announce that I will soon be interviewing Brent Metcalfe. We also talk about the concept of translation, Joseph Smiths views on his translations, the traditional apologetic responses concerning the Book of Abraham (Hugh Nibley, John Gee, and Kerry Muhlestein), as well as the LDS Churchs recent essay on the Book of Abraham. Leave a Reply Cancel reply. I was going to ask the same thing. Brent Metcalfe - Practice Lead - Mergers and Acquisitions - LinkedIn $95k AVERAGE INCOME Our wealth data indicates income average is $95k. Shortly after returning home and leaving the church he was very active in Sunstone and various things of that nature, but has since moved on with his life and seems very happy with a small family of his own running a small restaurant he and his older brother own together. brent metcalfe excommunicated. If Krakauer can interview Dan Lafferty, it might be possible. Who does he think the last bomb was meant for? You are hesitant to answer no evil speaking on what you cant say right ;). I cant wait to listen to the second half! We had some technical difficulties. The Book of Abraham? They leave the church, but it doesn't leave them alone Every metric you can imagine points to the same conclusion: from Paul VI forward, Catholicism has gone into deep crisis. In Episode 497, Brent Metcalfe shares an interesting fact that when Steve Christensen was called to be a Bishop that he told his Stake President that he would never excommunicate a member of his ward and if that was a problem that he wouldnt accept the calling. They even go so far as to claim that Zarahemla was directly across the river from Nauvoo, and that the waters of mormon are Big Springs, MO. Twitter. I was only 8 when Steve died, so I just remember his smiling face and that everyone, especially my parents, just loved him. 52K views 2 years ago Iowa's Brent Metcalf took down Ohio State's Lance Palmer in a thrilling title bout at 149 pounds in the 2010 NCAA wrestling championships. Brent, thanks so much for sharing your tender moments as well. I do remember after my baptismal interview having a strong feeling of love and admiration for him because someone so respected thought I was special too. As an atheist I am not without my own inconvenient truths. I am war weary defending truths that just dont appear true anymore. He was going to have him thrown out of the church. Brent's review of challenges to traditional approaches to the Book of Mormon. Thank you so much for the story and the insights. Some suggest that energy-conservation constraints favored our thoughts sliding along low-resistance neural ruts that include simple feel-good narratives. [4] His supervisor removed the probation, but on April 8 Metcalfe's employment was terminated. Follow @BHMetcalf. I dont agree with all the conclusions of your research but the research is a gift to all of us. The LDS Church fired Brigham Young University professor David Wright for his contribution to the volume, and excommunicated both Wright and Metcalfe shortly thereafter. o David Wright was excommunicated for apostasy in April 1994 for his nontraditional views on Mormon scripture as exhibited in essays like his chapter in New Approaches to the Book of Mormon. Im not saying you need to have spiritual experiences to validate your work by any means if the facts are facts, but a higher power confirmation always helps. I just got done reading the book Mormon murders. I have that info direct from Mac himself. On my mission in England I met a older, wise non LDS woman very knowledgeable on esoteric and metaphysics teachings. I just finished listening to part one and I loved it! I have question on the Book of Abraham. She was excommunicated for it and it was ironic that her uncle, David O'McKay, was a member of the twelve apostles at the time (and later became Prophet.) And am I the only one who likes the older music better? Come to the dark side and tell your story. This was interesting all around. I was a writer for 7th East Press. Given that, do you think that Joseph Smith deliberately plotted, prepared, researched, drafted, re-drafted the book over several years, or did it flow spontaneously from his subconscious mind in ways even he didnt understand? Metcalfe (ed. 0% MARRIED [1], In the early 1980s, Metcalfe contributed to the Seventh East Press and Sunstone, while at the same time worked as a security guard at the Church Office Building of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints (LDS Church). They buried the Mclellin diaries also.similar thingdidnt like the content. What a fascinating glimpse. Brent H Metcalf, 71 Resides in Salt Lake City, UT Lived In Sandy UT Related To Kyle Metcalf, Molly Metcalf, Kristy Metcalf, Nicole Metcalf Includes Address (3) Phone (4) Email (3) See Results Brent Charles Metcalf, 55 Resides in Lowell, AR Lived In Modesto CA, Oroville CA, Bonney Lake WA Also known as Gary Brent, Metcalf Brent So sorry for the delay!!!! brent metcalfe excommunicated. OMAHA, Neb. Mormonism LIVE !: 025: The Adam God Deception - Radio Free Mormon Brent Metcalf in California - Spokeo Thats what I expected from church leaders.I meanSalamander spirit !! 32 Years Later - Would Mark Hofmann Kill Again? - Wheat & Tares Your excommunication reveals more about your accusers than it says about you. Lex, the recommendation by Andrew is a good resource. This has to be one of my top 10 favorite Mormonstories podcasts. Truth or legend? by | Jun 23, 2022 | replace flower bed with gravel | pickleball courts on staten island | Jun 23, 2022 | replace flower bed with gravel | pickleball courts on staten island Read More: Where is Terri Christensen Now? Davison's Brent Metcalf avenges loss to win NCAA wrestling - Mlive I went to BYU and graduated with honors but I did everything I could to get out of reading or to read beforehand what I could be asked to read out loud. I was hoping you would have spoken more about the Book of Mormon and Abraham. The Gift of the Mormon Faith Crisis Podcast. A special thanks to Brent for giving up so much of his time to do these episodes, especially some of them as he was feeling very much under the weather. Privacy Policy. As soon as we can! Very cool, any personal stories youd like to share? Metcalfe is on the editorial board of the John Whitmer Historical Association. In his response, he controversially included an encrypted message spelling out "Metcalfe is Butthead." In True Crime Series 'Murder Among the Mormons,' LDS Church Reckons Be the first to contribute! I havent listened to MS for several years now, but with Brent being interviewed I couldnt miss this, and I wasnt disappointed. He is their emotional support and Sue's constant companion, her voice, advocate and her angel. Yes! He said that a response finally came not from Hofmann but from one of the Lafferty brothers who was apparently Hofmanns cell mate or on the same block or something like that. Brent Metcalfe on Hofmann aftermath, his own excommunication - reddit https://signaturebookslibrary.org/?p=24440. All rights reserved. But such intellectual issues didnt play a role in my failure of faith. Not everyone who doubted the authenticity of Hofmanns forgeries did so for valid and sound reasons. I understand the church spent large sums of money on BYU professors and private research to bolster the Book of Mormon claims through archeological discoveries.unfortunately they have not found what they had hoped for. Brent Lee Metcalfe is an independent researcher and writer of the Latter Day Saint Movement. In Gnosticism Abraham is not even a real person, the story represents the triumph of spirit over matter and is loaded with hidden symbolic meaning. The failure of faith concept was very interesting, and I can only say but for the grace of God. Hofmann really believed he could pull it all off, and maybe it wasnt just the police who thwarted his scheme? Save my name, email, and website in this browser for the next time I comment. Im glad the church and BYU tried and I dont blame them for making the attempt to shore up the Book of Mormon. Let me be equally clear that I dont believe that the BoAbr is an authentic translation of the papyri he possessed. This is one of the best MS interviews I have heard so far. John and I are just trying to align our schedules, so expect parts 3 & 4 soon. Jerald articulated his concerns in one of his ministrys publications. Im pretty sure I was standing next to Maxine. Im with you on the music Charles!! Is there going to be a part 3? About a year or so ago when I finally left the church I looked him up to get advice and catch up on old times. My faith failed me and that led to crisis. ping anser putter 85068 value; italian village commission. Looking around me, every object was changed, and a bright glory appeared on everything. "[10], Naifeh, S., & Smith, G. W. (2005). This is one of my all-time favorites. accounting for llc member buyout; black barber shops chicago; otto ohlendorf descendants; 97 4runner brake bleeding; Freundschaft aufhoren: zu welchem Zeitpunkt sera Semantik Starke & genau so wie parece fair ist und bleibt 7 czerwca 2022. Ive struggled to understand the human mind in this regard. She was very impressed with the level of esoteric teachings in the D&C and Pearl of Great price. Few people had more of a front-row seat than Brent Metcalfe to the goings-on surrounding Mark Hofmann, the Salamander Letter, and the tragic events of October 1985 what would be dubbed as the Mormon Murders.. The problems he discovered lay at Josephs feet, but he threw out the baby with the bath water as if the success of Christianity rode on the success of Joseph Smith. It was so, so interesting. :( Will re-record hopefully soon! BOOK OF MORMON SCHOLARS UNLEASH SALVO OF BARBS - Deseret News :-) I really R E A L L Y loved the podcast, and will listen to it all again today. Thanks so much for posting this. I appreciate the details of Brents experience. Coming from similar backgrounds, Mark and Brent subsequently began working together on finding and authenticating documents, which eventually turned their relationship into a friendship. Part 1 of the interview stuck much closer to home for me. I am waiting patiently for part 3. In the past, we often got snippets of information in The Church News, Brent Lee Metcalfe - Wikipedia Are there still more episodes of this series on the way??